We talk about WordCamp Orlando 2017 November 11-12 A Hurricane Free Zone, plus what’s the local WordPress community like in Orlando.
Lisa and David organize WordPress Orlando, and both have been organizers of WordCamp Orlando since 2012. They fulfill a variety of roles in the community and enjoy the collaborative nature of WordPress.
More Lisa Melegari
Lisa was a web content writer, lured into WordPress when David Laietta sought her help in running the local WordPress meetup. Seven years later, she’s still there, even though her career has taken her out of the content business.
She’s currently the lead organizer for WordCamp Orlando and when she’s not doing WordPress things, she’s acting as an advisor for her local chapter of Alpha Phi Omega, cooking tasty foods, and wrangling her 10 cats.
David is a website developer, and founder of Orange Blossom Media, where he builds custom themes and plugins for WordPress, among other things.
In addition to having awesome features, WordPress has an awesome community. David has been lucky enough to work with incredible people in this community and put on events of his own. He is the lead organizer of the WordPress Orlando Meetup, as well as WordCamp Orlando.
David, teaches frequently, including one on one lectures, small group presentations, and in a professional capacity for organizations looking to train their users.
Here’s A Full Transcript of Our Interview With Lisa & David
Kim: Hey everybody. Welcome to the WP-Tonic episode 226. We’re getting up there. Today, my co-host Jonathan Denwood and I are going to be interviewing Lisa Melegari and David Laietta. Two incredibly successful WordPress organizers who organize both the WordPress Orlando Meetup and WordCamp Orlando. And we’re going to be talking about what it takes to organize a large and successful meetup. And hopefully, inspire some of the rest of up to maybe start our own Meetups or at least jump on, going to some local ones because it’s a great way to meet people. Lisa, would you tell us a little bit about yourself please?
Lisa: So, I actually started WordPress thanks to David. He found the WordPress Orlando group as it was and asked me to help him start rejuvenating it and getting more people, more activities. And I’m an Event Planner at heart, so I love getting people together and organizing conferences and what not, so it was a given. And WordPress just kind of fell along with that. But I really enjoyed, I used to build websites back in the old days of HTML and Angelfire and what not. So it was good to kind of get back into that.
Kim: Excellent. And David, please introduce yourself.
David: I’ve involved in the WordPress community here in Orlando since 2012. There was WordCamp in Orlando since 2009. But, a private company was running. And Lisa mentioned, they stopped doing it. So we brought it back from the dead. And right now, we are, what, on our seventh year that we’ve been involved here in Orlando. We have a very active meetup group that we’ve been running for the past 6 years with about two or three events a month, depending on the month.
David: It’s a lot of fun. And it’s very active and we have a very great group around us.
Kim: Excellent. Thank you. And my co-host, Jonathan, please introduce yourself.
Jonathan: Oh, hi there folks. I’m the founder of WP-Tonic. We’re a service maintenance company and we specialize in WordPress, it’s our passion. Back to you Kim.
Kim: Thank you. I’m Kim Shivler and have newly co-hosting this Podcast with Jonathan and we’ve been having a good time finding new WordPress people to join us and start talking about what they do. I’m not too far from Orlando. So I have been able to be involved a little bit, not too often in your WordCamps and yet again this year I will be out of town. But would you guys tell us what it takes? It really is a vibrant vibrant group. What it took to get in there and turn that around, kind of a dwindling group? What’s the secret sauce there?
David: Okay. Well, I’ll jump in since I kind of dragged Lisa into coming into this. I should say Lisa is our most dedicated organizer for the group found here. She’s at pretty much every single event, even some of the ones that I don’t end up making it to. It was not that difficult to find a group of like minded people who were interested in this. We have a thriving tech community in Orlando. We have a lot of people who are involved with WordPress here in the area. Maybe not in Orlando specifically, but in Central Florida, we have a lot of people who have plugin shops, theme shops, core contributors and the like. So it was actually not that difficult to find a group of people who are interested in this. The hardest part was just managing and maintaining events. Every month there’s so many small tasks that have to happen and somebody just had to step up and do it. And that I will make that happen.
Kim: So then Lisa, is it really the two of you that manage all those tasks? Or do you have some other volunteers helping you also?
Lisa: We definitely have other volunteers. But at the core of it, David and I are a bit too stubborn to kind of let everything go. So we are known to kind of micro manage things a bit. That’s why we’re at pretty much everything. But we do have a very great team of other volunteers, especially when it comes to organizing WordCamp because there’s no way just the two of us alone could ever do that.
David: And I just want to, sorry, to step in and clarify. When Lisa says we’re too stubborn, she doesn’t necessarily mean that like we’re trying to take away from other people’s ability to do things. More that we’re too stubborn to let things go undone. Sometimes we have last minute cancellations or someone’s not able to get something together for one of our Workshops or something and we just end up making it happen.
Kim: That makes sense. I think you have to be to run a successful group like you guys do. How many people are you expecting at WordCamp this year?
Lisa: Hopefully, since this will be our first year, fingers crossed, hurricane free since last year, we are hoping to get at least 400.
Kim: Excellent. It seems like you had a good crowd. I couldn’t go last year because after the hurricane and then when we scheduled, I was out of town. But it seemed like you had a pretty good group the 2 years that I was there.
Lisa: Yeah. Go ahead.
David: Normally we sell between 400, 450 tickets. We’ve done really consistently, except for last year, had about a 90 percent actually attendance rate. So that’s been really great that I can pretty much count every time we’re going to get about 90 percent of the tickets sold, will actually attend. Last year was a bit of a fluke. We had a hurricane the weekend that we were supposed to have it. We were able to quickly regroup and get our venue for 2 weeks later. But that did affect some sponsors and speakers showing up. But it was still a great event.
Kim: Excellent. And I noticed you made it a little later this year so maybe we’ll take it out of the hurricane way.
David: Yes. We tried to go earlier last year, actually, because we wanted to avoid being too close to WordCamp US again. And last year was the first year we tried scheduling it in October. And clearly, the weather does not want us to do that.
Kim: Not in Florida.
Kim: Not at this time of year. In fact, as we’re taping this, those three of us in Florida have a storm headed our way. Just the time of year. You’re going back to Rosen this time, right? For your venue?
Lisa: Yeah. We were at Canvas which a downtown coworking space in 2015. It was a great venue except we had problems with classroom size. We had standing room only in several of our Workshops, several of our talks. And we found that it just wasn’t as intimate as we wanted it to be since it is a public venue. Whereas Rosen, we always do it on a Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Fridays, they have very few classes. And Saturday and Sunday, the campus is empty. So we get the run of the whole place. The Rosen staff has been amazing helping us out. Everythings included with the venue. The tables, the chairs, the WiFi, the projectors, all that kind of stuff. And because it’s a hospitality school, they actually have their own catering staff. So they cater full hot lunches and we have no problem with the all day coffee. It’s really a great venue.
Kim: I agree. And that was why I wanted to ask that. I was a sponsor at each one and I liked both of them. But the Rosen, the hospitality school, like you said, because the amenities are there since it’s a hospitality school, it was just so nice. And you guys have so much room for sponsors that a lot of WordCamps don’t have. I would tell anybody out there. If you’re looking to sponsor a WordCamp, definitely look at this one. Because you guys have just such a nice area for sponsors where you can have a table and that type of thing. It’s still a reasonably priced sponsorship level.
David: We have both indoor and outdoor areas at our camp. And again, barring the hurricane last year, but even the 2 weeks later when we came back, we’ve had amazing weather. It’s the best time of year to visit Florida. The middle of the Summer, I don’t want to live here. But in November, it’s wonderful. We can be outside. We did a networking brunch the second morning of our camp where we get bagels, fruits, mimosas, things like that. It’s more of a way for people to come and network with one another. And that’s been great that we’ve been able to hold it in Rosen’s courtyard every year. Doing it at Canvas was actually my fault. So every year except for 2 years ago when we were at Canvas, we’ve been at Rosen, which as Lisa said, is an amazing venue. They’re really great for us. But I put a little challenge to myself being the last year that I was the lead organizer, that I wanted to do something a little bit different. And that I wanted to try to expose more people to Orlando. We’re very lucky that we have a lot of people travel from outside of Orlando both to speak, sponsor and just to come to our conference. And Rosen, while a great venue, it’s an island onto itself. You have no reason to leave that campus which is great for during the conference, but afterward, you don’t get to see anything else. At Canvas, we were able to showcase the growing tech community in Orlando. We had the space donated by, again that coworking space and Iron Yard a tech school, sorry, a, I’m trying to remember the name of them. Boot camp, a tech boot camp. So we were able to show off some of the areas where tech companies are in Orlando. And then get some of the local venues to cater food, send people out for lunch to restaurants downtown. I liked the idea that people could go see more of Orlando while they were here for our camp. But, as Lisa said, it wasn’t perfect. And making those kind of arrangements when companies are always in flux is also a little difficult.
Kim: Right. It was a lovely venue also. It was. And it was fun to be downtown. I liked the idea of getting to show people downtown. Because like you said, where Rosen is, it’s out by itself and it’s also, it’s closer to like the typical touristy Orlando stuff that and all. Whereas I really enjoyed going to the downtown. But I was part of definitely finding the classrooms size to be very difficult.
David: Yes. That was unfortunate.
Lisa: Admittedly 2015 was my favorite year so far. I loved the venue. And I was the food and drink coordinator at that. And being able to connect with all the restaurants and set it up so that our attendees could experience some Orlando food rather than just catering and such. That was both a challenge and a lot of fun. And then also, that was the year of my so far favorite theme which was the Harry Potter theme. And that’s where we debuted our Wapuu pins.
Kim: Yeah. In fact, mine is on my desk here somewhere.
David: Yeah. I have a large collection of Wapuu pins now. I’m very happy that they became a thing. In fact, one of our organizers runs the website wapu.us. W – A – P – U – . – U – S. And I just like the fact knowing that we were able to do something that other people ended up doing. I would say within a month after the end of our camp, I received emails and texts from 10 to 12 other organizers of camps around the country asking me where we got our pins, what info they needed to get their own for their camps. Now every time I go somewhere I see a pin and my collection is growing and growing.
Kim: Yeah. They’re fun. I love them because they don’t take up too much room and they’re cool. You can have that little souvenir. That and my WooCommerce Ninja pin I really like. That’s my other one that I got last year that I liked.
David: Some of the challenges that we have, as Lisa said, that Rosen handles almost everything for us which is great. We’re paying them for a level of service that is, it’s people who that’s their job is to make those things happen. And then we’re even working with students who are basically getting it as credit for their classes to be able to cater a large scale event. But some of the things that we have to think about, end up being the things that you wouldn’t think that you would have to worry about too much. For instance, we wanted to make sure that we could cover parking for our attendees downtown because we had the budget for it and downtown parking is not free and we want to make sure that we’re not making an undue burden for our attendees to be able to come and worry about that. It turns out that it’s surprisingly difficult to manage parking in Orlando. There are multiple different departments. I tried contacting several people I know that work for the city and everybody directed me to someone else. I go to Orlando’s parking group thinking that of course, they’re going to be the ones to handle it. And they go, “Oh, no. You have to go to this building”, that they do it. And then I go to the building and they’re like, “Well, no. We’re actually are owned by this other company. So handle they handle this”. And eventually, I find somebody who works at City Hall. And I go, “Look. We just want to give someone a lot of money upfront to pay for parking. If it doesn’t all get used, then you get extra parking this weekend. That’s all I want”. And surprisingly difficult to find someone who wants to take our money.
Kim: But you did finally?
David: Eventually, yes. Yes. That still ended up being a hassle for a while after the event developed. That’s a different story.
Kim: Oh. That’s funny. Is it because they contract it out to private companies?
Kim: Okay. I’ve had to deal with that a little bit in my life. So I thought that’s the problem right there, getting the right person.
David: Yeah. And the companies that are in those buildings are not the people who own those buildings.
David: You may think the Amway Arena, Amway owns the parking structure for Amway Arena? They do not. You might think that SunTrust Bank manages the parking for the SunTrust Bank parking garage which is the closest one to our venue. They do not.
Kim: Right. Yeah. I get that. Fort Lauderdale is the same way, by the way.
Kim: If you ever need to do anything down there. Although, if you ever need to do anything down there, I actually do know the company that runs almost every parking lot in Fort Lauderdale. If you ever need to do a venue there.
David: Well, now we do.
Kim: One of the things that I, and this could be for either of you or both, that really impresses me about the events that you do is, a lot of times I’ve been involved with meetup groups and it’s just once a month we get together and maybe somebody speaks or whatever. But you guys actually have like fabulous formal classes on How to Build Themes, How to Build Plugins. How did you pull that together and what’s the response been for offering that?
Lisa: Well, that was something that David actually started. We had been doing the Meetups as a regular, every month we have two speakers, Q and A between networking time, end of story. And the thought was, there’s more that we could be doing. We had polled our group every year during our holiday party to find out what topics they want. If they’d like Workshops or Meetups at a different venue or a different time or a different date. And we were hearing a lot of people saying, we used to be on Saturdays, saying we wanted to go back to that Saturday. So the decision was made to do a little more long form thing on Saturday since people have the time and turn it into basically a mini workshop. And the response we’ve gotten from that is amazing.
David: Yes. As I mentioned, we host usually two or three events a month. And we try to gear them towards different groups. For instance, most of our regular lecture Meetup, I would say 80 percent of the attendees are either business owners or general WordPress users. They’re people who are focused on, “How can WordPress serve a specific purpose for me?”. Which is great. I really like cultivating that group. But then we also have one of our organizers who said that he wanted to see more Developer Meetups. And he was going to start a different meetup group specifically for WordPress developers. I should clarify that our meetup group is part of the WordPress foundation. I don’t have any stake of my own in maintaining ownership of it. I said to him, “We already have 3,500-ish members in our meetup group. Instead of starting a brand new meetup group, just host some events through the group that we already have. And just let people know these are for a specific type of people”. So the Workshops that we have running right now are to teach people how to start developing with WordPress. And we make it clear when people sign up that, you’re going to need to come with your laptop, you should have a little bit of knowledge already known here. We take notes at those Workshops. So I go, “If you need to catch up, here’s the notes from the old ones”. So it’s been a good way to reach a new portion of users. We had our workshop a week ago, 2 weeks ago. And Lisa, how many people would you say were new to our meetup?
Lisa: At least 20 or so. And the Workshops have been consistently out growing our regular meetup attendees. We were shocked. We lost seating. We had no seats available for some people one of the last times. It’s a good problem to have.
Kim: Absolutely is. Excuse me. Everybody, we’re at our time for our break. We’re going to take a quick break. And then we’re going to come back and talk a little bit more about Meetups, Workshops, and all that good stuff.
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Kim: You’re going to start Jonathan?
Jonathan: Oh. Sorry Kim. Kim. Kim wants me to come back. We’ve been having a fascinating discussion with Lisa and David, organizers in Florida of WordCamps, Meetups. They are WordPress in a way in Florida though. So David, reflecting on taking over this, what are some of the lessons you’ve learned from taking the lead initially and in Lisa helping quite a bit?
David: Well, it definitely is something that I’ve maintained a lot more having Lisa around. I don’t know if I would have kept quite as much effort up if I didn’t have a strong number two there. And Lisa has also taken a lot of initiative on things which is the most important thing. In that, a lot of things that we do, it only happens because one person takes initiative and just says, “I’m going to do this”. Because everyone wants to have some sort of ownership of what they’re doing and so it’s really hard to say, “Can you go do this thing? Can you go secure this venue? Can you go confirm with that speaker?”, or something like that. But if somebody comes up and says, “I want to do”, for instance, wanting to do the Workshops, then they are more inclined to make that happen.
Jonathan: That’s great. So the actual planning of a WordCamp, does it basically almost start as soon as you finish one, you’ve got to start planning the next one?
Lisa: In one respect, yes. One thing that we’ve been doing for the past, probably about 4 years is as soon as the WordCamp is over we decide on a theme for next camp. And that way our creative team can get running on website designs and logo designs and Wapuus. And I’m the one who writes most of the stuff on the website. So I get to start with my little, like with the Harry Potter, everything was all magical themed. And with Lego, everything was building themed. And now we’re into superheroes, so everything is superhero themed as far as our Marketing materials go. So that’s the fun part right after WordCamp is deciding which area are we going to take this to next.
Jonathan: Oh, right.
David: Yeah. It’s something that I don’t see enough camps taking advantage of which I think is, one, a missed opportunity, but also something that can be a very useful starting point for a camp. In that, when you’re trying to design something, when you’re trying to create verbiage for your site, when you’re trying to get everything organized, if you have some sort of central theme, it helps jump start new ideas. So the first year that we were involved, we didn’t have a theme for the camp. Then the next year in 2013, I thought we should do some sort of theme. We went the very obvious route of camping which it worked out. It helped us design our badges, our signage, the website, everything else. James Tryon, who I mentioned runs Wapuus, he’s done that design work for us every year. He does great work. The next year we did video games. And that is personally my favorite. And that is the favorite of everybody who wants one of our T-shirts or stickers every time they see it which they are all gone. Maybe we’ll have to get some new ones printed. Magic of WordPress was the following year. And then the year after that was Building with WordPress. That just happens to look like certain plastic building blocks that you might be familiar with for legal reasons. And then this year, Lisa made the decision that this year’s theme was going to be Superheroes.
Jonathan: Oh, right. That’s great. How hard is it to find, you said you’ve been very fortunate to have somewhere to have the WordCamp that’s been really helpful. Did you have to approach quite a few different campuses, different organizations before you find a partner that was really helpful? Or has it been reasonably easy to find somewhere that you wanted to do the WordCamp?
Lisa: Well, we were actually gifted Rosen so to speak. When we stepped in in 2011, I think we kind of showed up, we had found out that one of the people that was organizing it at the time had ties to Rosen college. And so, they were able to get the venue at a discount and what not. And so that was already pre-established. However, in 2016, when I took over, we wanted to explore other venues.
Lisa: And so we put the search for other places that could house us. And it is amazingly difficult to find a venue that can fit between 300 and 500 people that isn’t astronomical. That has the ability to split up into at least four different classrooms. Because you can find a huge banquet hall or you can find a little tiny 12 person conference room. That’s easy. But to find the exact thing, what we need, was really difficult. And at the end of the day, we decided, why ruin a good thing. We’ve got Rosen. Let’s stick with it. Attendees that come back year after year, they’re already familiar with it. There’s not a huge learning curve for new people to come in and try to find everything. It’s a very well laid out campus. As much as we’d love to be downtown more and more in Orlando proper, they just don’t have the venues that are in a reasonable amount of money.
Jonathan: Yeah. So if you’re looking to do one of these, you’ve got to really keep that in mind then. It’s not going to be that easy to find a well suitable place to do it really, is it?
Lisa: Yeah. And there’s a reason that Central says, “Start with your local colleges and school campuses”, and what not because they usually are the best equipped as far as having individual classrooms, already having the projectors and the WiFi all set up. We tried doing it at the Doubletree Hotel down in Orlando and they were going to give us their whole conference floor. But they were going to charge us an arm and a leg just for the rooms, let alone food and drink and everything. In my experience, it works out best in those kind of settings.
Jonathan: And how do you plan what speakers you’re going to have? Do you actually have a meeting where you discuss what, is it going to be kind of a search track certain linkage to speakers? Or is it you just do a general, “We’re looking for speakers”, and you see what subjects come up? And how do you select the right mixture of speakers?
David: This year we ended getting a record number of submissions. About 110 submissions that were actually within the time frame that we set for submissions. Because if anyone here is involved in organizing a WordCamp or rather I should say for us it’s been the case. Every single year, the day after our deadline for speaker submissions, that’s when we get a bunch of emails for people going, “Oh. I missed the deadline. Can I still submit?”. It’s a bit easier to have a blanket statement. Lisa’s been doing a great job of fielding all of these responses of just saying, “We’ve had a record number of people. We don’t have the space to take new people”. What we end up doing is anonymizing those talks a bit. We remove all of the information about the speakers and any information about them and just show the talk title and the talk description. And then we have the organizers go through for a few days, review all of those and vote on the ones that they think sound the most beneficial. The ones that they would most like to hear or they think would be best for our group. However, that doesn’t always bring the best ratio of talks. So myself as a developer, I am much more likely to hear a talk about Developing than I am about Getting Started with WordPress, let’s say.
So after we have all those votes in, it’s a good guideline for who should be selected. But it doesn’t mean that’s exactly who’s going to go in. For instance, we always have way more Development talks and we have Design talks. So we have to skew a little bit outside of, let’s say our vote range, to get a few extra talks in that are towards a specific topic and then lose a few of those Development talks. That also is a good way. Our Speaker Coordinator, he looks at the talks as they’re coming in, tries to get an idea of the balance the talks were getting and then reaches out to people if necessary. We always do that every year.
We don’t have the space to take new people”. What we end up doing is anonymizing those talks a bit. We remove all of the information about the speakers and any information about them and just show the talk title and the talk description. And then we have the organizers go through for a few days, review all of those and vote on the ones that they think sound the most beneficial. The ones that they would most like to hear or they think would be best for our group. However, that doesn’t always bring the best ratio of talks. So myself as a developer, I am much more likely to hear a talk about Developing than I am about Getting Started with WordPress, let’s say. So after we have all those votes in, it’s a good guideline for who should be selected. But it doesn’t mean that’s exactly who’s going to go in. For instance, we always have way more Development talks and we have Design talks. So we have to skew a little bit outside of, let’s say our vote range, to get a few extra talks in that are towards a specific topic and then lose a few of those Development talks. That also is a good way. Our Speaker Coordinator, he looks at the talks as they’re coming in, tries to get an idea of the balance the talks were getting and then reaches out to people if necessary. We always do that every year.
There’s people that you just want to see or that you want to hear from. We have some people who’ve never spoken at one of our events that we’re like, “We need to get you to come and give a talk. You’re always here, one of these years”. But we also can see, “Okay. We haven’t as many Design talks. Let’s reach out specifically to Designers we know and ask them to submit”. Some people just don’t know the talk is up or they don’t think that people would want to hear something they have to say. Or one that we get a lot is people don’t think they’re qualified to talk. And for some reason, they think every talk is a Development talk. We have so many people who say, “Oh. Well, I mean, I would love to talk but I’m not a developer. I don’t know what to talk about”. And I go, “How many Meetups have you been to? How many times is someone talking Development at our Meetups?”.
Jonathan: Yeah. I think that’s great. I think we’re wrapping up and we’ll go for our bonus content folks. We should be able to see on our YouTube channel and on the website an additional 10, 15 minutes discussing how to organize a WordCamp and how do you foster real community in your local Meetups. So Lisa, how can people get a hold of you and learn more about what you’re doing and what you’re up to?
Lisa: Well, I’m on Twitter at L – M – E – L – E- G – A – R -I and you can come find me at any of our WordCamps, at our WordPress Meetups. I attend all the WordCamps in Florida as often as I can and usually hop up to Atlanta. Unfortunately, this year, I have to miss WordCamp US. I’m actually changing careers. But WordPress remains in my heart.
Jonathan: Oh, wow. And you a selection, a very handsome looking cat as well, don’t you?
Lisa: This one of my 10. She’s the one who’s always on my desk when I’m on conference calls.
Jonathan: Right. Yeah. Very handsome beast. David, how can people get to know more about you and what you’re up to David?
David: They can find me on Twitter @davidlaietta. That’s L – A – I – E – T – T – A. And I’m also during a separate event the week before WordCamp Orlando this year called CabinPress. Funny, I was aware that Mendel Kurland of GoDaddy was doing CampPress. He talked about it a few years ago. And of course, it just so happens that after I decide, “Oh. I’m going to launch a separate event, he decides to finally launch his event”. Granted I think, or that one’s about 2 weeks.
So if you have to choose, choose both. But if you’re already coming to Orlando or you might want to come to Orlando for WordCamp, the weekend before we’re going to be doing a camping trip, kind of a disconnect from technology. I’m trying to focus it on Web business owners. And it’s going to all cabins. So it’s going to be no real ruffing it or anything. More just to have a good time. Lisa’s going to be cooking a lot of delicious food. We’re going to be doing some kayaking, canoeing, all that fun stuff. And the week between the two events, Canvas, that coworking space that we were at, we’re going to have that space available for anyone who wants to work during that week. So if anyone is thinking of coming to WordCamp Orlando, check out cabin.press, is where you can find information about this event. It’s the first one. Hopefully, it’s not the only one. I have to see how we do on ticket sales.
And the week between the two events, Canvas, that coworking space that we were at, we’re going to have that space available for anyone who wants to work during that week. So if anyone is thinking of coming to WordCamp Orlando, check out cabin.press, is where you can find information about this event. It’s the first one. Hopefully, it’s not the only one. I have to see how we do on ticket sales.
We’re going to be doing some kayaking, canoeing, all that fun stuff. And the week between the two events, Canvas, that coworking space that we were at, we’re going to have that space available for anyone who wants to work during that week. So if anyone is thinking of coming to WordCamp Orlando, check out cabin.press, is where you can find information about this event. It’s the first one. Hopefully, it’s not the only one. I have to see how we do on ticket sales.
Jonathan: Yeah. I’m sure it’s going to be a success. You sold it to me. If I could make it, I would be tempted actually. You have sold it. Kim, how can people get to know more about you Kim?
Kim: You can find me on Twitter @kimshivler or you can find me at whiteglovewebtraining.com.
Jonathan: That’s great. And if you want to know more about me. It’s quite easy. You can find me on Twitter @jonathandenwood. You can email me at jonathan.wp-tonic.com. I do read my own email. I’ll get back to you in the next couple of days. Love people to suggest guest ideas for interviews. And if, we say it every week, but it does really help the show, if you can give us a review on iTunes. That’s really great. It’s been a fascinating conversation. WordCamps and Meetups are the kind of building blocks of the WordPress community and the organizers have slightly a thankless job doing it. I know the amount of work that’s involved because I’ve been involved in those myself. So I’d like to wish you Lisa and David, thanks for doing all the work you’ve done. It’s great. And we’ll be continuing the discussion like I said on bonus content for about 10 minutes which you’ll be able to see on the website and on the YouTube channel which is growing almost every month which is great news. We’ll see you next Wednesday where we’ll be interviewing a WordPress community member, a business owner in the WordPress space or somebody who’s a WordPress junkie. See you next week folks. Bye