Strategies on eLearning to Market Your Business in 2023

Jeff Cross is the media director of ISSA, with flagship media brands that include print publications Cleanfax, Cleaning and Maintenance Management, ISSA Today magazines, and all related digital publications and multimedia products. He is the previous owner of a successful cleaning and restoration firm. He is also a trainer and consultant for business owners, managers, and front-line technicians and is an IICRC-approved instructor.

Main Questions For Interview With

#1 – Jeff, can you give us an outline of what led you to your present role with ISSA?

#2 – What are some of the main challenges ISSA faces commercially in 2023?

#3 – How important is “eLearning marketing” as an effective tool to market ISSA to your target audience and also, how important is WordPress as your main online marketing platform?

#4 – Can you give us a couple of examples of “eLearning marketing” that has increased the membership of the ISSA that you are most happy with?

#5 – If you go back to a time machine at the beginning of your career, what key advice would you give yourself?

#6 – Are there any books, websites, or online recourses that have helped you in your business development that you like to share with the audience?

This Week Show’s Sponsors


Sensei LMS: Sensei LMS

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Episode Transcript


Welcome to the WP-Tonic This Week in WordPress and SaaS podcast, where Jonathan Denwood interviews the leading experts in WordPress, eLearning, and online marketing to help WordPress professionals launch their own SaaS. Welcome back to the WP-Tonic This Week in WordPress and SaaS.


[00:00:00.220] – Jonathan Denwood


We got a great guest here. We got Jeff Cross here. He’s the media director of the ISSSA. We will be talking about eLearning Marketing, as I call it, and about WordPress and how you combine the two. It should be a great show. Also, I’m on a winner here. I’ve managed to actually pronounce Jeff’s name without totally butchering it, which some of my poor guests over the past few weeks have had to put up with my total inability to do. With grace and humility, they have put up with that. Jeff seems up for it. He’s already had to put up with a full start, but he seems up for it. So, Jeff, can you quickly, in about 10, 15 seconds, introduce yourself and what you do at the ISSA?


[00:01:16.300] – Jeff Cross

You bet. Let me start my Timer. There we go. I used to be a journalist. I worked for a newspaper many years ago. I got into cleaning to raise my family, wrote for one of the magazines I now manage, and eventually became the editor of that clean facts. And eventually ended up at ISSA, where I now head up three different publications. And I run a media team here. We produce print, digital, video, all that. And that’s where I’m at. And that’s 20 Seconds.


[00:01:41.360] – Jonathan Denwood

That’s great. You’ve done excellently. I’ve got my great co-host, Kurt. Kurt, would you like to introduce yourself to the listeners and viewers?


[00:01:49.310] – Kurt von Ahnen

Absolutely, Jonathan. My name is Kurt von Ahnen. I own an agency called Mañana no Mas. I specialize in learning and membership websites and getting things done on time and under budget.


[00:02:00.030] – Jonathan Denwood

That’s great. Before we go into the main meat and potatoes of this great interview, we’ve got a couple of messages from our major sponsors. We’ll be back in a few moments, folks. Are you.


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[00:04:19.280] – Jonathan Denwood

Plus, we got a curated list of recommendations for your WordPress website’s best WordPress plugins and services. To get all these good deals, you have to go over to WP-Tonic Deals and WP-Tonic Deals, and you can get special offers and a list of curated recommendations. So you don’t have to roam the internet and waste a whole day trying to find the best solutions for your WordPress website. What more could you ask for? So, Jeff, let’s go into a bit more detail. What led you to the ISSA? I was really impressed with what I consider your training and eLearning marketing activities. You seem to be doing everything right on my list of what people should be doing if they’ve got an association or they’re trying to build an online community. You really seem… I was very impressed with your activities. So what led you to do all this activity online? What’s been the process, basically? Sure.


[00:05:40.940] – Jeff Cross

I got started many years ago when it was all about print before the internet back in the day. My focus was always producing magazines. Newspapers and magazines were what I did. Eventually, as time went on, the websites came out, the blogs, the forums, newsletters, etc. That’s really when things got interesting because that was where we had to open our and broaden our focus on bringing content to those that need it. So where we’re at today and how I got here is through that, through the magazines I worked for, a clean fax, clean and maintenance management, being acquired by ISSA over the years. And we also have a member magazine called ISSA today. And it’s not print; it’s everything. As you mentioned, Jonathan, we do the digital, the websites, and social media is now a big part of our work. And my success with everything with the team is we look at what is going on in the industry. What are they talking about on LinkedIn, on Facebook? Who’s saying what on Twitter? And we try to avoid politics, of course. But what is it that people need? What do they want?


[00:06:50.980] – Jeff Cross

It’s about networking, whether it’s face-to-face. Social networking isn’t new.


[00:06:56.820] – Jonathan Denwood



[00:06:57.270] – Jeff Cross

In the day, it was over coffee at a diner. That was social networking. Well, now it’s electronic mostly. But just listening to the industry, we serve our members first at ISSA. That’s our focus. But we’re also responsible as a global trade association. So as avoid voice for the industry, so as a voice for the industry. So we represent everyone. And so you’ll see on the programs I do, not just ISSA members, but others involved in the industry. So it’s just about what is needed and how can we deliver content to fill that need?


[00:07:30.550] – Jonathan Denwood

So you do a podcast, I’m correct, and you do a lot of interviews and news about the industry on YouTube. Has this been a long learning exercise to find the right content, the right fit for your audience? And what has been some of the stumbling blocks along that journey?


[00:07:53.080] – Jeff Cross

Okay. To find the content, it’s just about paying attention to what people are talking about. And also, we’re very visible. Issa is in our media team. So people come to us, Hey, I’ve got an idea. We listen to it and we get a pitch. Sometimes it’s about products. And of course, that’s a different category. That’s not what I do. But if it’s about concept, thought leadership, then we talk it out and we create an article, a video, a podcast. So we have different platforms. We do, like I said, the print magazines, my video programming. I don’t do a traditional voice only podcast. We do the videos like we’re doing today. And then we create also a voice podcast from that as well. So we have straight talk, Take Five with clean facts, ISSA alerts, we have G Back, a TV, a Biotok program there. Just so many different ways to reach different segments of the market. But we listen, we watch, we get pitches. People come our way with a great idea and we develop it. And then we see if it works. And what’s nice about digital, as you know, is we can track how many views you get, how long they’re watching it, is it a dude or a win?


[00:09:02.630] – Jeff Cross

And that’ll drive our next topic as well. So a lot of good stuff happening. Everyone wants to know what are the new trends, what’s new? Well, it’s changing every day. And it’s just.


[00:09:13.620] – Jonathan Denwood



[00:09:14.680] – Jeff Cross

Taking care of those you serve. Taking care of those you serve, taking care of those, for I used to say, our members. Our members for them is taking care of their buildings and those that they clean for.


[00:09:25.860] – Jonathan Denwood

Right. Over to you, Kurt.


[00:09:28.480] – Kurt von Ahnen

Thanks, Jonathan. Jeff, what do you think would be some of the commercial challenges that ISSA would face in 2023 and the immediate future?


[00:09:39.800] – Jeff Cross

Okay. As any organization has the same challenges, we have the labor issues, trying to find good help. I think at ISSA, we have a solid team of professionals to serve our members. But challenges would be a little different from traditional companies. A traditional company has to have a profit and has to answer to shareholders or those stakeholders. With ISSA, we’re a nonprofit, so our focus is serving our members and maybe spending money that other companies would not to get something done. But every day is crazy busy. I live by the calendar, and I think all of us at ISSA and the challenges we face is getting it done every day just because there’s so much to do. And we have so many projects, the eLearning projects, the different workshops and seminars and all the events we go to. And say, show North America, the challenge is we need clones. And that’s not a reality. So we just work hard to get it done.


[00:10:39.130] – Kurt von Ahnen

As a follow up to that, you had mentioned finding people, right? And I talked to a lot of folks that say finding people, finding people.


[00:10:48.170] – Kurt von Ahnen

What are some tools at your disposal that you think help filter people in or get people to find you for the attention?


[00:10:56.450] – Jeff Cross

Sure. So for me, the only hiring I do is for the media team. I’ve hired a few editors and experts over the years. I find them not the traditional way. Not putting up a help wanted sign. You get all kinds of applicants, but I use social media. I go on LinkedIn and I look and talk to people. I invite people to apply and my apply is just tell me you’re interested and we’ll talk. I’ve got some great people that way that didn’t come through your traditional online hiring platforms. Those still have value and I get if you got to fill a position. But I hire, I look for personality. It’s like in our industry, do you hire someone who can actually clean well or do you hire someone with the right attitude? You can train to do the cleaning. So for me, it’s about is the person able to network and talk to others, represent the brand as a person, as a good person? Or are they the technical, I spell every word right? Those are important things. We are editors, we are writers. But to me, more importantly is what do you like as a person who’s going to represent the brand?


[00:12:01.840] – Jeff Cross

And so you start looking for people like that, and you find there’s some really good applicants out there and they’re looking for a challenge or looking for something more than a job. So that’s what I do.


[00:12:12.770] – Kurt von Ahnen

Cool. I like that. It’s the second time that you’ve mentioned using social media socially instead of a billboard, right? So there’s a core message there.


[00:12:21.820] – Jeff Cross

Yeah. And like after we’re done today, I think I’m connected with Jonathan on LinkedIn. Kurt, I don’t know where we are, but I’m going to find you.


[00:12:29.720] – Jonathan Denwood

I’m on LinkedIn, man.


[00:12:32.210] – Jeff Cross

Everyone I work with, if I interview eight people for an article, I don’t need to do it. But I do. I go on LinkedIn and I connect and it’s a network. To me, LinkedIn is a great resource for business. And of course, we do Twitter and Facebook and TikTok. I don’t do TikTok, but I have a young editor who’s smart that does that for us.


[00:12:53.070] – Jonathan Denwood



[00:12:53.990] – Kurt von Ahnen

Jonathan, can I toss it.


[00:12:55.040] – Jeff Cross

Back to you?


[00:12:56.000] – Jonathan Denwood

Yeah, sure. Just a quick before I go on to the next question, would I be right in also saying, Jeff, obviously it’s a non commercial association. So to some extent, it’s driven by subscriptions. So obviously, it looks like we’re entering a more difficult business cycle in the next couple of years. So what you’re doing online, do you think it’s a crucial tool to keep people, to keep them willing to pay their subscriptions? Because it really shows your giving value for that subscription.


[00:13:36.640] – Jeff Cross

Absolutely. Any association has members and they pay an annual fee or some type of fee to be involved. Every industry has them. And for us, we are the one for the cleaning industry. And so we have to add value. We are always talking about what can we give members, what can we give them more of or new products. And from my department media, it’s about content, videos. People get those as far as being part of the industry. But as members, they get priority. So we try to focus on our members first. But yeah, it’s always a challenge to keep giving more and coming up with good ideas. But that’s our focus. And with everything I used to say offers, there’s so much for everyone, from HR benefits to medical to the eLearning products, the value of clean platform we have. All those things add up to… It’s more than a yearly payment. Along to a trade association, almost every industry, unless maybe you’re a doctor or lawyer, is very inexpensive. It’s more about what you get than what you pay.


[00:14:45.770] – Jonathan Denwood

Right. So it’s linked. Obviously, we have a focus on WordPress. Our audience are developers, implementers, designers, entrepreneurs. I do another podcast that’s about membership and about eLearning and learning management systems. So we’ve got a very diverse audience, but they’re all making their living online, basically. So how important… First of all, do you recognize the concept? I’m not sure I’ve made it up or I’m sure I heard it from some other people. I’m a terrible copier, Jeff. So learning marketing, do you identify that statement? And maybe you can see what in your mind, what is eLearning marketing? Only a small question. And the second question, obviously, there’s a lot of SaaS platforms aimed at associations. There’s a lot of choices about what your main digital contact platform you utilize. WordPress are just interesting. What do you see as the benefits of utilizing WordPress compared to some of the SaaS aimed platforms specifically aimed at association? Only two small questions here.


[00:16:17.010] – Jeff Cross

That’s a long one there. Let me think. So as far as eLearning, I’m not involved or in charge of some of the eLearning that we do at ISSA. We have another department, education department for that. If you go to issa. Com, there’s an online learning center that has everything there for members and non members too. Some of it included with membership.


[00:16:37.570] – Jonathan Denwood

I see it as an overlap. I see your activity is that you’re the public face that shows what the eLearning you offer that induces them into the more structured eLearning. Am I on the right track there? You are.


[00:16:55.010] – Jeff Cross

I was going to mention next that with what I do with media is we provide content. Elearning is just about finding content online like newspapers. I get print subscriptions delivered to my driveway and my friends think I’m crazy. But I do like some things in print to open it up and look and hold. But I also do the electronic versions. E learning to me is anything you learn online or electronically. Think of books and books we read now. It’s all about Kindle and I don’t buy books anymore, but I do that. But for our ISSA members, the e learning is important, whether it’s a full workshop, several days of learning online, or maybe it’s doing an online course of some kind. But for media, we provide electronic products that are part of this that are provided to the industry, whether it’s a video or podcast or something digital as far as a newsletter. Your second part of your question, we use WordPress for everything. We’re WordPress platform company. I think everything we do at ISSA, as far as I know, is WordPress. Don’t ask me to build a site or know how to fix anything, but I do know how to publish on WordPress and we have experts that do that.


[00:18:07.020] – Jeff Cross

We just rebranded one site for clean fix. It’s a WordPress site. I don’t know what it’d be like with a different type of platform, but it made it easy to do. And it seems like all of our young, smart editors, they feel good in that platform. So I’m all for that. Sas, don’t ask me about that. I couldn’t really talk about that too much. But I do know we have a platform for association that deals with membership and all the moving parts with that.


[00:18:35.840] – Jonathan Denwood

But there is a lot of choice for the more marketing or you could look at Wix, you could look at Squarespace. Why do you stay? Is it driven by just the popularity of WordPress? Because you said your editors are comfortable. But is it also the element of you’ve got more ownership, more control over your own content. Does that appeal to you?


[00:19:02.490] – Jeff Cross

That is a big deal for us, and that is part of it. The fact that it works well with so many different platforms as well just seems to be the go to for us.


[00:19:12.680] – Jonathan Denwood

We’re going to go for our break. Jeff’s been very patient with me. He seems a very patient individual. We will be back in a few seconds, folks.


[00:19:26.890] – Kurt von Ahnen

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[00:19:59.050] – Jeff Cross

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[00:20:37.040] – Jonathan Denwood

We’re coming back. You’ve listened to a couple more of our great sponsors. I also want to point out, folks, that if you’re looking for great hosting on WordPress for your membership, for your eLearning platform, why don’t you have a look at WP Tonic? We provide everything to make the experience of building a community membership website really easy on WordPress, from great hosting that’s really aimed at your needs to providing email functionality, video hosting, everything in one platform from people that are experienced in helping you or your clients come over. If you’re looking for a great partnership, go over and go over to WP Tonic partners and see what we can build together. So over to you, Kurt.


[00:21:36.230] – Kurt von Ahnen

Hey, Jonathan. Jeff, one of the questions that we have, and I’m interested now how I want to rephrase this. I know that you’re not in charge of the learning division, but.


[00:21:48.540] – Jeff Cross



[00:21:49.520] – Kurt von Ahnen

There something in the company where you guys repurpose the learning content and use it in a marketing capacity? Have you seen a way to use that and possibly grow membership or leadership through repurposed content in the learning area?


[00:22:03.600] – Jeff Cross

Yeah, I think so. We often take some of our education material and create editorial content out of it and use that way. Cross sharing or sharing content across brands platforms is important to us. So, yeah, we do that. We have a topic somewhere in ISSA, and do we just let it sit there as that product? Well, we might. But if it’s of interest to others, we might then take and create a video out of that or something in print. But we do have certain things we keep just for members, and we listen to what they want as well. So if there’s something that they need, then we’re going to develop it. And even though I’m not involved with that department directly, we do all work together. So we talk, we have meetings, and we figure out what is needed and we provide it. So, yeah, cross sharing and promoting is a big part of our strategy. And on social media, we are like, what can we do with this? Well, we could send an email and we do that, or we could do a big social media promotion, maybe spend some money on a promotion as well as just organically.


[00:23:11.930] – Kurt von Ahnen

Yeah, I love that answer because I have a a corporate background and I can remember working for larger companies where things were completely siloed and there’d be a complete line of content coming out from one department and another line of content coming out from a different department. And you would think to yourself, Why did I spend half a million dollars a budget when this content is already over here?


[00:23:32.830] – Jeff Cross

The word silo gets mentioned a lot and we try to avoid those.


[00:23:37.140] – Kurt von Ahnen

Yes. Excellent. Excellent. Jonathan?


[00:23:43.030] – Jonathan Denwood

So it’s a follow up question. Obviously, you have a budget, you’re responsible as head of media for the association. Now, the association is driven by subscription. Obviously, you got short, medium, long term objectives. The medium are to get more subscriptions. But a lot of your activity, it can’t be directly, Well, we did this promotion, we did this show, we did this, and this had a direct increase in subscriptions, or had a direct increase in people resubscribing, a lowing of churn in the subscription. It must be how do you measure the effectiveness of the programming and the outreach that you’re doing? Or is that an ongoing discussion between you and your chief financial officer? Yeah, it’s.


[00:24:54.340] – Jeff Cross

An ongoing discussion. And we have a sales department that works on this as well. So our media brands are not run on paid subscriptions. So maybe that’s a clarification we needed. We provide our media products to qualified industry professionals. We are supported by advertising. So with our magazines, our online, our videos, you’ll see advertising in those, much like this program here, if you have sponsors for your own program. And they pay a fee to be part of our brands. And the reason it works is when we show, well, this video we did on this topic produced 4,200 views that went as long as your sponsor message. So the branding is there. And then we have our webcast, which has sponsorships and direct leads tied to that. So different ways of sponsorships that provide value to those who are supporting us. And then the association, of course, is based on annual subscriptions or annual membership fees and other things we do as well, other products we sell. So many moving parts like any organization. But for media, it’s about supported by advertising. So that’s why we have a church and state approach. Our editorial content is about editorial, not products, and we have the ads around that to support it.


[00:26:12.530] – Jonathan Denwood

So that’s a really good combination, isn’t it? Because that eases some of the pressure from the subscription side, doesn’t it? Because a lot of the finance of what you do is coming from your sponsorship. Is it very difficult to get the right sponsorship partners, though, that got the right attitude towards it all?


[00:26:38.220] – Jeff Cross

I think it’s a win win for everyone and our sponsors see the value. So if you have a product to sell or service to sell, you want to be in front of people who are buying, right? And that’s our audience. So we qualify our subscribers. They’re business owners, managers who are purchasing products that the sponsors are selling. And so if you have… Some of our videos have done very well. We’ve had 8, 10, 20,000 views on some of them. Those are people in the industry. You don’t have teenagers watching those. You don’t have retired people who are on a boat watching those. You have people in the industry watching those, people who are buying the products. So if I have something to sell, if I have the best widget in the world for $25, I want people who want that widget to watch the products that’s in. So that’s our goal.


[00:27:31.990] – Jonathan Denwood

And also they get the benefit of association with the association in the way because there is a transfer of this product. We are allowing them on our platform. You are transferring some of your credibility to these sponsor partners, aren’t you?


[00:27:55.520] – Jeff Cross

Yes, obviously. And sometimes things don’t mix properly and it doesn’t work. But for the most part, it’s a good relationship.


[00:28:06.010] – Jonathan Denwood

Over to you, Kurt.


[00:28:08.430] – Kurt von Ahnen

I get to ask the fun question, Jeff. If you had a time machine and you could just push a button and roll back to the beginning of your career, what.


[00:28:18.690] – Jeff Cross

Advice would you give yourself? I would tell myself to buy Google stock and Apple stock, maybe some Yahoo. Good question. Fun question. I would say I would tell myself to focus on the big picture and the small stuff, don’t sweat it. In my early days, I sweated the small stuff. I thought I had to do everything. And you get to this point in your career, it’s like, Well, what’s the big picture? It’s the relationships, the making things happen that make a bigger difference. Sometimes I would choose in the media brands I worked on to cover things that I thought were important or of interest. And that might be true sometimes. But I think I would tell myself to talk to others and ask them what we should do. Talk to the readers, the audience, ask them, what do you want to see us do? And that’s something I think I would tell myself. I’d work with smarter people. I think back then, I wouldn’t admit it that I wasn’t the smartest one. But now I will do that. We learn as we get older. I would tell myself to surround myself by smarter people, let them grow.


[00:29:27.800] – Jeff Cross

And that’s a smart move to work with people who know more than you. At this point in my life, I could run a roofing company. I don’t know how to do a roof, but I would hire the right people and it would work. So that’s what I would do. Just things like that. And I would buy Apple.


[00:29:43.670] – Kurt von Ahnen

Buy Apple. I think about the three faces on this podcast, and we all show a little bit of seasoning, right? One of the things that I think about, because you had mentioned print and you had mentioned some other things, and I used to work in some of those industries myself, is I think about the adoption rate of how I digitized myself. So how I adopted, I always thought of myself as an early adopter of My space and social platforms and things, but I was a little bit slow coming off of print and going digital. How do you feel that that approach helped you in your rise?


[00:30:20.580] – Jeff Cross

Great point, Kurt. I think everyone did that. We see all the newspapers out there who are no longer around because they didn’t adopt digital. I think if I could tell myself when the first website went up, stay ahead of this, make this a focus, then we’d be ahead. We’re doing great with digital. I think everyone’s done some catch up, but we still do print. We do fewer pages in print and more digital. Our revenue is shifting that way. But yeah, it’s something that you see these newspapers going out of business now. And some are not. Some are doing the subscription digital model, like where I live here in Columbus, Ohio, the dispatch. Without knowing too much about them, I subscribe, but they do a digital model that works and they still do print, but much more digital. So t hat’s something important to do. And if you miss the boat, the boat’s gone.


[00:31:20.200] – Kurt von Ahnen

Yeah, it’s hard to catch up. If you get too far behind, it’s really hard to get back with it.


[00:31:26.220] – Jeff Cross

Jonathan? Yeah, I’ve got a funny throw at it.


[00:31:28.720] – Jonathan Denwood

Yeah. Go for the few question. I would imagine that physical trade meetups and conferences are important. Obviously, that got all disrupted by COVID. Obviously, COVID is, thankfully, to some extent, in the rear mirror to some extent. Does it mean that the industry goes back to trade conferences face to face, or is it more… It’s coming back to some degree, but also the digital side is still going to be a lot more important. Can you see where I’m going with this question? I do.


[00:32:19.580] – Jeff Cross

So in 2020, we pivoted from our live trade show to online only one, and it worked. That’s what was there. And then ’21, we went back to in person. And I believe we also had that digital as well, and that worked. But people want to be with people. When it comes to a trade show, you want to go and physically talk to people and see products. Is there a place for a digital trade show? There is. But I know for myself, like with education, sticking on a Zoom workshop all day long is really tough. Whereas you can be in a classroom engaging with people, seeing them, and it’s much easier. So I do training as well for IISRC. It’s for the carpet cleaning and restoration industry. And I did not do any online training. I said, I’m going to wait and I’ll do the classroom training when it’s back. That’s just how I prefer. I believe in digital. I believe in online, eLearning and all that. But when it comes to trade shows and certain types of training, put me in a classroom.


[00:33:21.380] – Jonathan Denwood

Yeah, I agree with you there. So when it comes to marketing and eLearning marketing, what are some of the website’s online resources persons? Maybe you can name a few people that you… You know what I mean? There’s certain people you see if they’re being interviewed on YouTube or they’ve got article or they’ve got something. You spend a couple of minutes and you give it a read or you look at the video, that type of thing. Yeah.


[00:33:58.930] – Jeff Cross

So I do spend a lot of time on social and looking at articles and videos there and YouTube as well. Whatever catches your attention. I look at things as how can I get an idea for my brands from that? Back in the days, I’d walk through airports and look at magazine covers looking for ideas. What are people talking about? What inspires me to do something? Today it’s more what do I see online with articles? I do read some business books and there’s a few out there that I like. There’s one I remember called 12 Rules of Life by Jordan Peterson. Fantastic book. So many others out there, but I read to see what can I do different or better. That’s my focus. Unless I’m reading a John Grisham book, then it’s to enjoy a good story. Like I mentioned, I get newspapers and magazines. I receive a magazine called The Week. It’s very short, concise, small bites of information. We’re all too busy to spend a lot of time on large content pieces. When I look at a video and it’s 20, 30 minutes, that’s an investment. Whereas if it’s two or three or four, then it’s more of I can do that.


[00:35:05.970] – Jeff Cross

And I struggle with keeping things short on the video side myself. It’s very tough to do. But stay current, stay educated. Education in the classroom is one thing, but seeing what’s going on around you and looking at social… I’m not talking about the silly stuff we see on social media, but what can we learn from our peers? What are they doing? What are they talking about? What issues are they presenting? And that’s where I spend my time.


[00:35:33.000] – Jonathan Denwood

That’s great, Jeff. So, Jeff, what’s the best way people can find out more about you? What you’re up to online, basically, Jeff?


[00:35:41.600] – Jeff Cross

The easiest way is our issa. Com website. There’s a media tab there, and you can see all our brands, podcasts, and videos. My email is Jeff Cross@ issa. Com. Very simple. It’s my name @ issa. Com. I am responsive. I will answer questions, my cell phone numbers, and all our publications. I get a lot of spam calls as well. But I want to be available to the industry. And if anyone has a great idea that they think could be part of our programming, drop me an email, text me or call me, and we’ll talk. But issa. Com is where you start for everything we’ve got.


[00:36:18.800] – Jonathan Denwood

I want to say, folks, if you want to see an organization that’s utilizing the learning on WordPress in a really effective way for their niche industry, follow what Jeff’s doing because I was impressed with the volume and the strategy that Jeff is utilizing. That’s why I asked him on the show because I was really impressed. So, Kurt, how can people really learn more about you and what you’re up to?


[00:36:50.360] – Kurt von Ahnen

Well, follow Jeff’s lead, man. I am on LinkedIn. I’m the only Kurt von Annen, which makes me easy to find on LinkedIn. You type that in; I’m the only one there. So Kurt von Annen is it. Also, anything that is Manyana no Mas online typically belongs to me that’s really well branded, manananomas. Com.


[00:37:09.140] – Jonathan Denwood

I want to point out we got our Round table show next week, folks. We got a join us at around 8.30 Pacific Standard Time live. We got a really impressive panel. We got Jason, the founder of WP Engine. Hopefully, we got Jonathan Weld, who’s just been the director of Guttenberg with WordPress. Com. We got Kirk, and we got the regular panel as well. It should be a great round table show. We’ll see you next week. Have a great week, folks. See you soon. Bye. Hey, thanks for listening. We really do appreciate it. Why not visit the Mastermind Facebook group? And also, to keep up with the latest news, click wp. Tonic. Com newsletter. We’ll see you next time.


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